I think everyone should have a "third party" asshole when they buy a car.

I don't think you mind being a dick any time or any where from what I can tell... lol

^ That's not funny.

Cue Jeff telling them their own IP in 3... 2...

Le sigh.

THEN FIRE ZE MIZZILES!!!

We have a real negotiating advantage now after Gordon's stint selling cars. He KNOWS what kinds of deals can be made, knows the little dick tricks many dealerships/salesmen will pull, including the little "extras" that they tack on to the invoice hoping buyers don't notice, or charging a higher financing rate (did you know the dealership gets to keep the extra money if they can convince you the finance rate is slightly higher?).

Of course, it was those dirty little tricks that Gordon refused to do to his customers that ultimately cost him his job.

And even though Saturn says they don't negotiate on price, if you do it right, they will knock off the cost of certain options on the sticker. At least my sales rep has done this in order to get my payments to what I say I can afford.

But I'm le tired...

What really annoyed me, in retrospect, was his lecture on how they deserve to make a profit and boo hoo for The Man. Wrong person to make that speech to. I don't hear it.

So what makes a car dealership any less worthy of making a profit than any other business? Seems to me they do deserve to make a profit, just as you the consumer deserve to spend as little as possible for the value you desire. That's what makes the negotiation so interesting and worthwhile.

Because many a time they are trying to make their profit by screwing you. Do it honestly and I'll throw a little money your way, but act like a normal car dealership dick and I'll eat you alive.

But that's just it. They can't screw you. They can't put anything into the deal that you don't get a chance to review prior to signing. You just have to do your homework and be assertive.

Car negotiations are the worst. The prey on people with bad credit who aren't internet savvy like those posting a comment here. I was talking to our salesman about people buying cars and he said he had one person trade in a brand new car, and take a loss AND a 15% interest rate.

I was actually the reasonable one in my girlfriend's negotiations. We got damn close to what she wanted for her trade, even with her check engine light on and the car being overdue for the inspection. We didn't get the deal we wanted, asked for a moment, talked it over, and got up to leave when they took our deal. We would have left the dealer had they not taken it and they knew it. Jerks.

Are you kidding, of course they can screw you! They give you bad prices on your trade-ins, they lie to you about what an "undercarriage treatment" really is, they tell you accessories you need that you really don't need at all. You can do your homework all you want, but when a professional begins lying to innocent customers just trying to get a car, I'd consider that the process of being screwed.

Once again, I'm grouping all car salespeople together, I've encountered a lot of bad car salespeople and, as a result, I'm always on the defensive. When you walk into a dealership, begin negotiations, and pull out a financial calculator, it's funny to watch their expression as they realize you're no longer an easy target.

When I walk into Express and go to buy a shirt, I don't have people telling me the shirt only works with a pair of jeans and shoes. Sure, suggestions may be welcome, but there is a fine line there and it is usually crossed by car salespeople. The idea that you need to prepare yourself in the first place to stop from getting ripped a new one shows the dealership's intent in the first place!

Great job ... too many people focus only on the price of the new vehicle and forget or simply don't pay attention to the back end of the deal ... financing, junk fees and most importantly, the trade. Most profit at a dealership is generated by the used car sales, service and financing. The new car operation is how they hopefully capture new customers ... given that, you would think they would minimize the nonsense at point of sale and let you leave feeling good about it.

I believe I read from a car sales expert that you should buy a new car with financing straight from a bank. He also recommended to sell your car yourself.

Definitely sound advice, but it's sometimes worth the money you lose (depending how much it is, of course) to avoid the hassle of selling the car yourself and just trade it in. I made my salesman miserable with all I asked for, but I got it all. I call that a personal victory.

Great article: http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying/articles/42962/article.html